Talking to your parents about their finances
I wrote a while ago asking readers what you folks are saying to your children about the economy's version of the green apple two-step. Things are getting bad enough that now I'm wondering what you're saying to your parents. The New York Times published an article today with some thoughts on how to open a very difficult conversation.
As for me, I did this twice fairly recently, once with my own mom and another time with an elderly woman locally who likes to think of herself as my New York mom. My own mom is in good shape: she is off the frugal charts, which she attributes to growing up in the Great Depression. She has half of my dad's Social Security, half of his pension, and her own Social Security as income, and that's worked out to be enough that she doesn't need to touch her investments, which are right down the crapper along with everyone else's, except for some bonds. Even better, all of her income is indexed to rise with inflation. I offered to send her money for extras as a one-time event or monthly as she preferred, but she firmly (and proudly) declined.
My New York mom's situation isn't that good. She's on retirement disability owing to a work-related accident years ago that took one knee entirely out of commission. Her husband (my New York dad) has a business bankruptcy on record: He lost his business in the eighties following a robbery in which he was shot and left to die. Both are in their seventies; even if they were more than marginally employable, it wouldn't be realistic to send them back into the workforce. They sold their co-op apartment right before the housing boom took off, and with one grifting adult child on the dole each month from them, I think they've eaten right through their capital. They have no other investments. One year, my New York mom asked me for a loan of $300 to cover back taxes, and I gave it to her as a gift.
In this dire situation, my New York mom called me a couple of weeks ago to ask if I needed any money. I told her that my job is safe (which it is, for now), that my living expenses are low since I no longer have a mortgage, that I just got a huge raise (which is true), and that I have cash saved up. I then asked her if she needed any money, and she said no.
I don't believe her, and I don't quite know what to do about it. Her husband would be too proud to accept money from me (he never knew about the $300), so I can only help them through my New York mom. I am thinking about slipping her an envelope with $500 when I see them next, but I'm not sure which it would do more, help them or hurt my New York mom's feelings.
I'd be much obliged if you could contribute your thoughts. What would you do?
Have you talked with your parents about their money? If so, how did you approach it and how did it go?
14 retorts. What say you?
Buying people useful presents is generally more acceptable than giving money I think as long as they can pay you back say with their time and effort (say cooking a meal for you) rather than feeling obligated to buy you presents too.
Just today my parents had a bunch of contractors come to the house to make measurements so that they can install new windows. The only problem is my Mom feels that everyone is giving her a great deal. The sad truth is 1. they are getting a bad deal & 2.There are bigger issues than new windows at the moment..
If you want to help, but you're worried about hurting or offending her, I was thinking maybe you could find out where they do business and pay their bills directly. They wouldn't have to know where it was coming from... I'm thinking things like a mortgage payment, electric bill, phone bill, that sort of thing... those would all be places you could possibly go to directly and make a payment on their account. I don't know, it's an idea!
My parents are in good shape, living frugally, and saving like crazy. Which is great peace of mind for us!
DH's mom is a completely different story. She is always asking for money because she blows hers on crap. We've always refused, but we offer help on setting up budgets etc. She doesn't want help living within her means, she just wants cash gifts to live it up. It's a tough situation because she often makes comments that she's going to be moving in with us soon and we'll be supporting her. It's even more tough because she's an alcoholic that always treated Mr Chiot's badly and never took care of him (fortuneatly there were others in his life that did). She's always bringing up the fact that she bought hime a bike once as a child and a pair of shoes and because of that he owes her. It's often a tough situation when money is involved and one person feels entitled to the other's money. I think she honestly feels that DH turned out so great and is so successful because she was a fantatstic mom & a great example. We're trying to figure out how to have "the talk" with her. Letting her know that she's going to have to live with the consequences for her actions and accept responsibility for the way her life turned out. I'm sure it won't be pretty.
I agree with Jennifer. I always prefer to give gifts as opposed to money that I assume will purchase those things. Your NY mom probably doesn't apply to this, but it's a good way of knowing that the money is actually purchasing what they need. Instead of giving money to a hungry person, I'll buy them a sandwich. (And I've actually had someone who had asked me for money for food decline the food and admit that they really wanted alcohol! Another guy told me he doesn't eat bagels, but told me to return it and go back inside and buy him a Coke. Sheesh. I didn't do it.)
I'm not saying that your NY mom would abuse the gift, but in your case it may help the pride a little.
What a great New York daughter you are! I know your New York parents must feel very blessed to know you.
I wish I had some great advice for you, but I don't. This is a difficult situation. I agree with one of the previous commenters about paying one of their bills directly. However, it's hard to know exactly where the money could be used most effectively (maybe they are behind on some bills, but not others). If you know your NY mom would use the money for bills and not blow it on something irresponsible (which definitely sounds like the case), then maybe giving her cash would be the best plan. Then she could put it towards whatever is most pressing at the moment. But then there's the pride issue.....man, it's tricky. I wish you (and your NY family) luck.
You have a great heart. I agree buying presents is better than handing over cash emotionally for the person receiving. I'd recommend a gift card perhaps to the grocery store that they utilize. Paying bills for them could be a little dicey but everyone needs to buy food.
I don't know what I'd go in this situation. I vote for slipping her an envelope, possibly in a way where she won't notice until after you've left, and therefore can't give it back to you.
By giving to your New York mom, are you helping her be an enabler to her parasitic grown child? As a parent, it is really hard to tell your children no, even though you know it's best for them so they learn to fend for themselves, and for the parent who needs to prepare for their own future. I don't know if that is the situation, but that's what I am reading from your post. It's wonderful that you want to help these people who have been so good to you that you consider them second parents. But if you give them money or free up money by prepaying an expense, will it be given to this child?
Thanks for your input, everyone. I really appreciate your ideas. Presents are a tough one: they live in a tiny apartment now and there is a definite clutter problem. (They manage to buy everything they need and quite a lot they don't need, but I suspect there are horrendous credit card bills floating it all.)
I'm torn between a gift card for groceries (I'm not sure if the store they usually go to has gift cards, but I'll check) and an envelope of cash. If I go the cash route, I have to accept the possibility that the adult child they still partially support will benefit. Alternatively, it's very conceivable that they'll spend it on gifts for me. They love giving gifts and spent a shocking (and very distressing) amount on me at Christmas last year. That's the last thing I want from these lovely but very vulnerable people.
The grocery gift card is sounding better all the time. I would really like to tackle the credit card situation, but I think that would be a breach of boundaries.
Frugal Z: Based on the comment you just left, New York Parents don't sound like the disability and lost business are at the deepest heart of the financial woes.
Supporting grown children, spending too much on gifts, and accumulating more material things around the cluttered apartment sound like immediate problems affecting their finances.
In a case like that, I would question giving too much of anything... But based on how I know a child loves a parent (even a "New York Parent,") I would advise giving meaningful gifts (like gift cards from the grocery store where they shop).
If you're like me, you give almost to a fault, so there's no stopping you anyway. LOL!
One comment above featured that ugly word "enabling," which feels so creepy to wear when we give out of love. But it is possible to throw money at a bad situation, making things worse for those in denial. Have you offered to help them in other ways (such as putting that clutter on ebay for them)?
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Hawa - yes. . . you are totally right that the root of my New York parents' financial problems lies in ongoing bad decision-making. Giving them money probably is enabling, but at their age I don't think they will change.
I've offered to help do a clear-out, but they've declined and I don't want to push it; I think it's a boundary issue. I did talk to my New York mom the other day and asked if I could give her a little something to tide her over for the holidays, and she said no. . . but I found out another way that their situation is every bit as desperate as I had thought.
The grocery card idea is still looking pretty good. Thanks for giving me a lot to think about.
Late to the game, but I wanted to second the notion of making some payments on the bills, that would likely help them where it's most necessary, if the grocery gift card doesn't work out.
I'm pretty sure you can call up the utility company and make a payment by giving their name and address.
revanche - thanks for weighing in. I've given the bill-paying a lot of consideration, and I don't think it would go over well. Knowing my New York parents as I do, I'm pretty sure that they'd have some major boundary issues with me doing that. They don't want me to know how desperate their situation is, and I have to respect that. It's a tough choice to have to make, though, because I very much want to help.
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